Imagine you're standing in a crowded public place a playground, a movie theatre, a grocery store when all of a sudden, you feel someone press something into your ribs. Once upon a time, Vince Li posed no significant threat to the public, and then he went off his meds with no one knowing. Thats plain wrong. He was deemed not criminally responsible and received mental. Now Li moved toward the back. Terrified passengers screamed for the bus to stop and massed for the door. "I'm not stigmatizing mental issues. It could not have ended any uglier. No one in authority listened to what impact this brutal murder had on Tims family and friends, not to mention traumatized witnesses on the bus. Vince Li, a personal trainer and mixed-martial artist, never imagined he'd get COVID-19. He got off, had a smoke, then reboarded. First published on May 23, 2012 / 9:51 AM. BRINGING LIFE TO THE DEAD WITH CGI TECHNOLOGY, SCHMEGELSKY & MCLEOD: THE SENSELESS STORY OF TWO KILLER KIDS, THIRTEEN TERRIBLY CLOSE CALLS WITH NUCLEAR BOMB ACCIDENTS, IS THE MEANING OF LIFE A HAM SANDWICH? YOURE ON DEATH ROW WHATS YOUR LAST MEAL? This advertisement has not loaded yet, but your article continues below. Vince Li was betrayed by his own brain chemistry. After he was deemed NCR, he was sent to the Selkirk Mental Health Centre for treatment. According to Summerville's transcript, Li recognizes that people fear him. He will be escorted at all times by a staff member and a security officer. To the average citizen, this case is more than a tragedy. In Canada, two elements are necessary to convict someone of murder: actus rea (the guilty act), and mens rea (the guilty mind). But he wasnt truly out of it. This isn't a call to have every person who suffers from mental illness monitored forever by law enforcement; but after someone has committed such a violent, traumatic act, he or she shouldn't ever be completely "free.". https://www.bookbub.com/profile/garry-rodgers. Li held minimal paying jobs at Walmart and did paper deliveries. Li emigrated to Canada from China in 2001 and became a Canadian citizen four years later. In his mind, he and his trusty buck knife had just slain a demon. / CBS News. In the early stages, everyone in authority agreed Vince Li wasnt operating in a normal mindset. Tim McLean sat on the passenger side by the window. HAS MADELEINE MCCANNS MURDERER FINALLY BEEN CAUGHT? On March 5, 2009seven months after Li took Tims lifeVince Li was found not criminally responsible due to a mental illness. When search suggestions are available use up and down arrows to review and enter to select. I don't think Vince Li can be trusted to take his medication.". The Guy on the Greyhound Bus got international attention. Thats a noble goal for psychiatry but a dangerous gamble for society. Hes not accountable for his crime in any way. And last week, after years of earning back small freedoms such as supervised day trips and unescorted outings, Li was, Victim's family disappointed by Vince Li's discharge, 'Mr. Li was born on April 30, 1968 in Dandong, China . Subscribe to it anywhere you listen to podcasts. Men puked. Li does not pose a risk to the public now that he is on his medication, according to the medical professionals who have treated him for the last near-decade. Er um what Rona said. "But what would be unforgivable for me would be to not do anything to try to prevent this from happening again by the same perpetrator. One of the officers who responded to the attack suffered from PTSD and later committed suicide. Please read the sidebar below for our rules. Everyone bailed off except for Li. Li wanted a victim and Tim McLean was it. This material may not be published, broadcast, rewritten, or redistributed. Two years later, he began unsupervised leave from the hospital but only for short periods. The Guy On The Greyhound Bus was Vince Weiguang Li, a 40-year-old Chinese immigrant to Canada who left Edmonton, Alberta eastbound for Winnipeg in the Province of Manitoba. READ MORE: Vince Li approved to live at group home in Winnipeg He was found not criminally responsible for beheading Tim McLean on a Greyhound bus back in 2008. WAS MARILYN MONROES DEATH ACTUALLY A HOMICIDE? Vince Li, seen here outside the Portage la Prairie provincial building last fall, goes on trial for the beheading death of Tim McLean. Its also existentially true that theres nothing stopping you from driving your car into a group of people, yet that doesn't mean you will. On March 5, 2009, McLean's killer, a 40-year-old Chinese-Canadian named Vince Li, was found not criminally responsible (NCR) for the murder, and was remanded to a high-security mental health facility in Selkirk, Manitoba, where he was detained until his release on May 8, 2015. He is seems to be still in shock after what he has witnessed. When Vince Li committed the act that he did he had been suffering from undiagnosed schizophrenia, and was in the throes of a psychosis-induced episode. Baker was found not criminally responsible (NCR) for killing Tim McLean on a Greyhound bus in 2008. By continuing to use our site, you agree to our Terms of Service and Privacy Policy. Since then I have been unable to think of July 30, 2008 with hatred in my heart only an unquantifiable sadness. WHATS YOUR EMOTIONAL INTELLIGENCE QUOTIENT (E-IQ) SCORE? A schizophrenic man who beheaded and cannibalized a fellow passenger on a Greyhound bus could know later this week whether he will be granted his freedom. This not criminally responsible due to a mental disability loophole goes too far. (AP) WINNIPEG, Manitoba - A Chinese immigrant who beheaded and cannibalized a fellow passenger on a Greyhound bus in western Canada four years ago thought he was attacking an alien, according to a mental health advocate who interviewed him. HOW DO YOU GET INTO CSI, THE CRIME LAB, OR THE MORGUE? DID VINCENT VAN GOGH REALLY COMMIT SUICIDE? But could it be prevented? Create an account to follow your favorite communities and start taking part in conversations. ELISA LAMS GHASTLY DEATH AT THE NOTORIOUS CECIL HOTEL IN L.A. Audience Relations, CBC P.O. Li at some point married a woman named Anna and became a menial worker at Grant Memorial Church, working there for six months despite the language barrier between him and others. Thirty-seven passengers were aboard the bus. It is a priority for CBC to create products that are accessible to all in Canada including people with visual, hearing, motor and cognitive challenges. I would ask forgiveness, but I know it would be hard to accept," Summerville quoted Li as saying. Its also about whats wrong with a broken criminal justice (legal) system and the strange world of forensic psychiatry. It causes one to lose contact with reality, and will often cause one to experience hallucinations and delusions that the individual will believe with absolute certainty are real and true. By 2015, Li was in a half-way house and only monitored for medication. He was quickly locked up in a secure hospital facility where monitoring and treatment commenced for an indefinite period. [Will] Baker is free. Vince Li was undiagnosed before he beheaded Tim McLean on a Greyhound bus eight and a half years ago, meaning he has never had to voluntarily stick to a treatment plan. BROWN DEATH BOSTONS MONSTROUS MOLASSES MASSACRE. Please try again. Seems he was an undiagnosed schizophrenic not prescribed the right meds. THE CIRCUS TRIAL OF THE EARLY 20TH CENTURY THE HALL-MILLS MURDERS, KILL DOZER MARV HEEMEYERS ATTACK ON A SMALL COLORADO TOWN. He knows that the medication works to keep the voices away.". Part Jeffrey Dahmer. Baker sat next to 22-year-old. Even the judge. Thats when hellish horror happened. Hes crazy. McLean, a 22-year-old Canadian man, was stabbed, beheaded, and cannibalized while riding a Greyhound Canada bus along the Trans-Canada Highway, about 30 km (19 mi) west of Portage la Prairie, Manitoba. Hear about the horrific bond between two of the most high-profile Canadian killings: the Brentwood Five massacre and the Greyhound bus beheading. In 1992, Li graduated from University of Wuhan Institute of Technology with a Bachelor of Science degree in Computers. With blood smeared across his face and three of . WHAT REALLY BECAME OF CAPTAIN KIDDS BURIED TREASURE? Judgment passed that Li was not criminally responsible for Tims murder due to psychosis caused by untreated schizophrenia. The decision was blasted by critics nationwide, as Canadians asked how a man who decapitated a Greyhound passenger less than 10 years earlier could possibly be set free. The flaws disrespect protection of society. WAS PRINCESS DIANA REALLY A HOMICIDE VICTIM? Its the overall picture thats never been put to rest. Vince Li knew exactly what he was doing and he remembered it. TAKE THIS TEST AND FIND OUT. There is no actual man in a mask, of course (if there was, there might be grounds for a duress defence a separate issue); rather "the man in a mask" is a euphemism for a mental illness that has you convinced you must hurt others, usually to stay alive. WHO REALLY KIDNAPPED AND KILLED CHARLES LINDBERGHS CHILD? Li is a ticking time bomb. THE BIZARRE DEATH OF THE TOXIC LADY GLORIA RAMIREZ, WHY FIFTY SHADES IS PHENOMENALLY POPULAR WITH (some) WOMEN. Not even God would pretend to be that precise. If you are a Home delivery print subscriber, unlimited online access is, Never miss a beat in Canadian Curling with the new On The Rocks newsletter, Stay Posted on Canadian Curling with the On The Rocks newsletter, Call Vince Li ('Will Baker') what he is: A cannibal killer who beheaded Tim McLean, WARMINGTON: The Kayla Lemieux show cancelled; no longer at Oakville school, Chris Rock will finally hit back at Will Smith over Oscars slap, Maple Leafs lose to Edmonton Oilers as Connor McDavid scores two Sheldon Keefe must find right fit for new defence, NO JACKET REQUIRED: Blue Jays pack away home run jacket as part of gritty new attitude, Vince Li is pictured at a court appearance in a Portage La Prairie, Man. Press question mark to learn the rest of the keyboard shortcuts. Li also boarded the bus a short time later. HOW TO WRITE A BOOK: JERRY B. JENKINS TELLS EVERYTHING IN 20 STEPS, MOUNT EVEREST WORLDS HIGHEST AND MOST DEADLY OPEN GRAVEYARD, OUR TOP 20 SPIRITUAL INFLUENCERS ALIVE TODAY, HOW WEB CONTENT WRITING WILL MAKE YOU A FAR BETTER WRITER, SUN DANCE FATAL LAST WORDS FROM FAMOUS FOLKS, HOW TO SCAM NIGERIAN FUNDS FOR YOUR TIME MACHINE, FATAL FLAW WHAT REALLY CAUSED THE TITANIC TRAGEDY, THE TIPPING POINT FOR BEST SELLING AUTHORS, COURTROOM COMEDY GREAT LINES FROM GOOFY LAWYERS, GILBERT PAUL JORDANTHE BOOZING BARBER SERIAL KILLER, HOW TO AVOID BEING MURDERED BY A SERIAL KILLER, THE NGI REALITY IN CRIMINAL IDENTIFICATIONS NEXT GENERATION SYSTEM, ARE YOU A PSYCHOPATH? Baker was found not criminally responsible of the 2008 gruesome killing of a fellow passenger on a Greyhound Bus. LINDY CHAMBERLAIN DID A DINGO REALLY GET HER BABY? Vince Li is free on the street. People are truly naive and sheltered to the evils of the world. Thats the flaw in the judiciary/psychiatric system. Will Baker, formerly known as Vince Weiguang Li, killed 22-year-old Tim McLean after hearing what he thought was "the voice of God". Vince Li, the accused in the Greyhound bus beheading of Tim McLean, appears in a Portage La Prairie court Aug. 5, 2008. Li slowly sat down. They told investigators and profilers exactly what they wanted to hear. He quit his job in 2006 and became a forklift operator. The board said the passes should only be granted if Li's treatment team believes his condition is stable and that it would be "appropriate and safe for him to leave the locked ward." Theres no system oversight. Without warning, Vince Li made a break for freedom. Vince Li, the man who was found not criminally responsible for beheading a man on a Greyhound bus in 2008, has been granted an absolute discharge. They relied on expert opinions from forensic psychiatric witnesses who were clinically detached from the scene. These guys can get crazier than The Guy on the Greyhound Bus. The public discourse around the trial has been disheartening, although I do recognize that it largely stems from ignorance rather than malice. "(Li feels) remorse, a degree of humility I know a lot of people won't believe that regret and a sense of torment," Summerville said Tuesday. Untold time and money were spent in rehabilitating Vince Li. As someone whose brother suffers from schizophrenia, Ive paid close attention to the trial of Vince Li - a man who has since changed his name for the sake of anonymity. markbonokoski@gmail.com Your Midday. We have to acknowledge he is sick, not evil, which means he can't be locked up forever. It took a bit to get Vince Lis medication right and stabilize him. The Guy On The Greyhound Bus was Vince Weiguang Li, a 40-year-old Chinese immigrant to Canada who left Edmonton, Alberta eastbound for Winnipeg in the Province of Manitoba. Tim smiled. As the bus stopped and horrified passengers fled, Li carved up McLean's body and ate portions of it. Please note that CBC does not endorse the opinions expressed in comments. McLean barely noticed, continuing to sleep with his head against the window, and his headphones on. THE CANADIAN PRESS/Trevor Hagan ORG XMIT: WPGT101, Will Baker, formerly known as Vince Li, leaves the Law Courts building in Winnipeg, after his annual criminal code review board hearing, on Monday, February 6, 2017. Tim let a blood-curdling scream. (ONE OF THOSE QUESTIONS MAKING YOU WANT TO PUNCH SOMEONE IN THE FACE). Two of them and the driver attempted to save McLean, but Li chased them away with the knife. Carol DeDelley, the victim's mother, called the board's decision unacceptable and vowed to continue her efforts to fight the law dealing with people found not criminally responsible. JUST HOW DEADLY IS NOVEL CORONAVIRUS AND COVID-19? Li, who has since changed his name. Li has an incurable disease that makes him do terrible things, Carol says. Unauthorized distribution, transmission or republication strictly prohibited. But when I realized just how deeply my brother was suffering from schizophrenia, I was forced to confront and learn about the illness. They took Li to a secure hospital. Keep us safe from guys on the bus like him. Li claimed he was not criminally responsible due to mental illness and the court bought it without calling traumatized witnesses and family members. Parts of the victim's body, placed in plastic bags, were retrieved from the bus, while his ear, nose and tongue were found in Li's pockets. When he killed Tim McLean, he stabbed him in the neck and chest with a large hunting knife. Then Tim leaned back against the window with his headphones on and drifted off to sleep. But Tims family had no input. Enter your email address below and get your FREE eBook IN THE ATTIC A Psychological Thriller Based on a True Crime Story. Last week, a Criminal Code review board decided that Li can start having escorted trips off the hospital grounds and into the nearby city of Selkirk. Vince Weiguang Li stabbed Tim McLean 50 or 60 times before cutting off his head A man who beheaded a fellow bus passenger in Canada in 2008 has spoken out for the first time, saying he believed he . Time does not erase or sanitize those facts. Its exactly like it never happened. Box 500 Station A Toronto, ON Canada, M5W 1E6. If he gets it, it will be as if McLeans murder never happened, with nothing on the books even mentioning Li. "Kill them," he whispers into your ear. Manage all your favorite fandoms in one place! They tried to negotiate with the crazy man holding a knife. I was an evil son of an evil god. Something to consider about killersthey can be very, very good actors. Wouldnt it be funny if we started a restaurant. On March 5, 2009, a Manitoba court found Vince Li not criminally responsible for the horrific death of Tim McLean on a Greyhound bus seven months earlier. Some havent recovered today. Part Norman Bates. Other passengers described Li as unremarkableup to this point. But nothing was done for Tim McLeans family or the traumatized people who watched Vince Li butcher Tim. He says he remembers what happened on a Greyhound bus bound for Winnipeg during that midsummer's nightmare in 2008. He blocked the door but police were miles away. WAS ALBERT DESALVO REALLY THE BOSTON STRANGLER? Its also the overall concepts of punishment, holding an offender accountable no matter what their mental state and ensuring the public is properly protected from future danger. Bus passengers were severely traumatized. Vince Li and the Greyhound Bus Murder (Bus 1170) - Eye Witness describes beheading (Interview) Serial Killer Minds 36.7K subscribers Subscribe 148 13K views 2 years ago On Greyhound 1170,. After he was deemed NCR, he was sent to the Selkirk Mental Health Centre for treatment. Women shrieked. There, he spent the night on a bench outside a grocery store. Convicting someone for only thinking about committing an illegal act, without them actually taking any action to do so, would be an example of thoughtcrime, something straight out of the famous dystopian novel 1984, by George Orwell. Get browser notifications for breaking news, live events, and exclusive reporting. Since that time, Li has undergone nearly nine years of psychiatric . THE CANADIAN PRESS/Trevor Hagan ORG XMIT: WPGT104, Will Baker, formerly known as Vince Li, leaves the Law Courts building in Winnipeg, after his annual criminal code review board hearing, on Monday, February 6, 2017. No one argued that. There was little regard for the publics protection that Linow Will Bakerwould be permanently locked up like the law should allow. He reclused like so many mentally-ill people do. The driver braked the Greyhound to an emergency halt. Im a retired Royal Canadian Mounted Police (RCMP) Serious Crimes detective and investigator with the British Columbia Coroners Service. HELPFUL OR HOMICIDAL HOW DANGEROUS IS ARTIFICIAL INTELLIGENCE (AI)? And people are flawed. THE CANADIAN PRESS/Trevor Hagan ORG XMIT: WPGT112, Will Baker, formerly known as Vince Li, leaves the Law Courts building in Winnipeg, after his annual criminal code review board hearing, on Monday, February 6, 2017. THE CANADIAN PRESS, Carol deDelley (right), whose son Timothy McLean Jr. was killed and beheaded by Vince Li on board a Greyhound bus in 2008, leaves with her sister Linda Lamirande after the annual hearing for Li at the Law Courts on Mon., May 14, 2012. To many, it won't seem "right" that someone has to check in with the legal system forever just because he or she suffers from an illness and committed a crime, but at the same time, it's arguably worse to assume that everything is fine, to shrug off whatever act landed the individual in the justicesystem in the first place, and to blindly trust that he or she won't decide one day that medication is no longer needed. It's so terrifying to me, that he was just sleeping against the window, something literally anyone in that spot would do. Its bullshit. Li might be a small player in the world of murders but hes not unusual. He was in the wrong place at the wrong time and a victim of circumstances much like the pedestrian creamed in a crosswalk by a drunk. McLean had his eyes closed and was listening to music on his headphones when Li suddenly stood up and started stabbing him. When he realized the true magnitude of the horrible and grotesque things he had done, because his brain had lied to him. She's not entirely alone. The psychiatrists. DID LIZZIE BORDEN REALLY AX-MURDER HER PARENTS? Six years after Vince Li beheaded a Greyhound passenger, another death: Mountie at the scene commits suicide. [1] [2] Incident [ edit] Its like theyve never ridden a bus filled with the common folks theyre supposed to serve. Arlington, VA: Author.https://web.archive.org/web/20100715171115/http://www.cbc.ca/fifth/2009-2010/bus_1170/timeline.htmlhttps://web.archive.org/web/20090315135511/http://www.edmontonjournal.com/Health/Beheader%2Bcriminally%2Bresponsible/1356476/story.htmlhttps://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/manitoba/bus-beheader-responds-to-treatment-psychiatrist-1.1031459https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/manitoba/vince-li-discharge-1.3977278https://www.cbc.ca/news/opinion/vince-li-discharge-1.3979861https://www.timslaw.ca/2009/04/18/vincent-li-a-decent-man-according-to-drstanley-yaren/https://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/national/how-the-mental-health-system-failed-vince-li/article17940205/https://steinbachonline.com/local/a-conversation-with-vince-lihttps://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5980581/#:~:text=First%2C%20relapse%20rates%20are%20higher,increased%20to%20over%2090%253.https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3599855/#:~:text=The%20authors%20found%20a%20mean,to%20receive%20maintenance%20antipsychotic%20treatment.Would you like to listen to my content in podcast form? Comments on this story are moderated according to our Submission Guidelines. August 5, 2008. I'm looking forward to putting more of my content into audio and developing new, original podcasts on mental health topics. RACHEL AMPHLETTA CRIME THRILLER/INDIE AUTHOR GOLDEN GEM. Li also told Summerville he would like to be forgiven. His own brain chemistry was failing him. Records are sketchy about his mental assessments. Nor was he taking any when he boarded the Greyhound bus. The innocent and unsuspecting victim was Tim McLean, 22, a carnival worker heading home for a break. When a court deems an offender "not criminally responsible" (NCR), it accepts that a crime was committed under these sorts of conditions. Vince Li spared Tim McLeans family a lengthy trial. On July 30, 2008, Vince Li, a 41-year-old man suffering from untreated schizophrenia, stabbed, decapitated, dismembered and cannibalized his seatmate aboard a Greyhound bus, 18 kilometres west of . He was shipped to a secure treatment facility. Tim McLean Murder (Vince Li) | Mental Health & Personality Dr. Todd Grande 1.17M subscribers Dislike Share 65,410 views Nov 20, 2020 This video answers the question: Can I discuss the mental. He had gone off his meds. The week following the attack, Greyhound Canada announced it was pulling a series of nationwide advertisements which included the slogan, "There's a reason you've never heard of bus rage.". A forensic psychiatrist was quoted saying at Lees release hearing that, in his opinion, Li had only a 0.8% chance of relapsing. A man in a mask is now standing inches from your face, holding one gun against your body and pressing another into your hand. COULD YOU WITHSTAND CIA ENHANCED INTERROGATION TECHNIQUES? The killer was released from the high-security mental health facility in 2017. But there are few who did what Vince Li did to Tim McLean. The aisle seat beside him was vacant. 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